Curse

Etsuko · Oct 02, 2008, 04:06 PM // 16:06

/notsigned

Glowy character is totally not cool. Aren't Chaos Gloves shiny enough for you?

I want a HAT, a custom title and my own chat colour. Thanks!

But seriously, I doubt this will "inspire" people to work on GWAMM if they haven't been bothering already, and will just make PVE look lamer than ever. ^_^

Solas · Oct 02, 2008, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Not signed.
Don't think attention needs to be drawn to Gwamm's if you go into Kama -1 and see 4 glowing Auras (some may leave them afk in towns) it kinda of seems common and a bit meh.

Leave it as it is imo.

ALF71BE · Oct 02, 2008, 04:43 PM // 16:43

/notsigned.

Stupid idea.

I don't think anyone is easily motivated by glowing and shiny stuff, besides OP of course...

A11Eur0 · Oct 02, 2008, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Speak for yourself, except change the second "P" to "E". Not that I have anything against PvE'ers, but it's usually people who complain about PvP'ers or whatever are referred to "PvE scrubs" themselves. I have a few PvE friends who aren't clueless, and using the word "PvX scrub" is pretty sad unless they just complain about X person's behavior.

But yes, if you "dedicated" 3.5 years to PvE why don't you just spend 250k on the Zaishen Chest? Yes, there are some complete idiots who think just because they can farm fame they are good, but you're just stooping to their level.

That's because it doesn't. If I can get away with not playing properly in PvE then it's obviously easy. Slap a few bars on and buttonmash and yay I'm done. And again, just because someone /Ranks you doesn't mean you should stoop to their level if they're doing it to be cocky.

So you're saying that because you're taking all advantages possible that's why PvE is easy? In a sense, it is. But I for one don't use SY in common vanquishing trips anyway. I usually play with a guildie running N/A, me running ED and then have 6 Discord Necromancers.

1: Zaishen chest is another PvP reward. The only way to get keys is PvP or to buy them from PvP'ers. I have spent money on zkeys but I prefer to spend money for the most part on other things, such as PvE armors and PvE weapons for my PvE characters.

2: People who run up to others in a PvE outpost and flash their /rank at them because they run a shit-waste build and were kicked out of a group are PvP scrubs. Those are the people I'm referring to. I didn't say dedicated PvP'ers are PvP scrubs...just the ones who seem to think that flashing a PvP rank to a PvE'er makes them better in any way. The only way to shut them the hell up is to respond in their fashion. That's how children work nowadays. Show something better and they go away.

3: You keep saying you win button your way through everything but have not posted specifics or evidence to that effect. People have been saying on this board quite often that sabway isn't a win button. Discord heroes are slightly better but really only work for caster profession players. Either way...if some heavy melee makes its way to your backline you develop attrition issues and you're suddenly on the defensive. Even the party-wide strong heals of a sabway necro team build can't help a melee spike on your healer, and my healer is always the first to be hit. Once he goes down, it's oh shit time when I scramble to eliminate the threat while having 2/3 of my healing in my group disappear. But this isn't a sabway debate. It's a debate on what to give people who dedicate one of their characters to getting max titles through heavy hard mode playing with severe disadvantages, and farming their asses off for the money titles. They deserve a little bit more than what they have. Do you hover over everyone in an outpost to find their titles? I don't.

4: You need to learn how to read. that's all I'll say on that.

Tyla · Oct 02, 2008, 07:46 PM // 19:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

1: Zaishen chest is another PvP reward. The only way to get keys is PvP or to buy them from PvP'ers. I have spent money on zkeys but I prefer to spend money for the most part on other things, such as PvE armors and PvE weapons for my PvE characters.

Buy them from people who play PvE, yes. Doesn't stop it being obtainable through PvE, does it?

Quote:

2: People who run up to others in a PvE outpost and flash their /rank at them because they run a shit-waste build and were kicked out of a group are PvP scrubs. Those are the people I'm referring to. I didn't say dedicated PvP'ers are PvP scrubs...just the ones who seem to think that flashing a PvP rank to a PvE'er makes them better in any way. The only way to shut them the hell up is to respond in their fashion. That's how children work nowadays. Show something better and they go away.

Fair enough, but you still shouldn't stoop to their level. All you should do is laugh at them because they think they're good.

Quote:

3: You keep saying you win button your way through everything but have not posted specifics or evidence to that effect. People have been saying on this board quite often that sabway isn't a win button. Discord heroes are slightly better but really only work for caster profession players.

Run anything with atleast a condition and a hex. Physical? Use X condition application skill and Asuran Scan. Most if not all professions have a way to inflict a condition through their primary, but seriously, if you fail with Discordway you're either terribly bad or got aggro happy.

Quote:

Either way...if some heavy melee makes its way to your backline you develop attrition issues and you're suddenly on the defensive. Even the party-wide strong heals of a sabway necro team build can't help a melee spike on your healer, and my healer is always the first to be hit.

PvE enemies rarely ever spike, if it's melee Enfeebling Blood > it, and even then I always bring atleast one copy of Aegis and/or Protective Spirit. Your defensive web is complete. Discord is the only required damage skill for it, and minions provide an incredible mixture of offense and defense.

Quote:

Once he goes down, it's oh shit time when I scramble to eliminate the threat while having 2/3 of my healing in my group disappear. But this isn't a sabway debate. It's a debate on what to give people who dedicate one of their characters to getting max titles through heavy hard mode playing with severe disadvantages, and farming their asses off for the money titles. They deserve a little bit more than what they have. Do you hover over everyone in an outpost to find their titles? I don't.

No, I don't. But why should you get rewarded for the simple but tedious task of PvE? As far as I've gone, I must say it's only "hard" when you get aggro happy. Oh, and this is coming from someone who is actually going for GWAMM at this moment...

Quote:

4: You need to learn how to read. that's all I'll say on that.

Oh yes. It seems I misread.

If you're failing with "Save Yourselves!", please just uninstall.

PvE is even easy without the assistance of PvE skills anyway.

Engage · Oct 02, 2008, 08:04 PM // 20:04

I've always found the title to be a bit pretentious. Mind you, there are other ranks that give the same impression. It gives players to a degree a reason indulge in how great they perceive themselves. An aura would only add to that and I do not see how in any way how it would help the game at this point.

NeHoMaR · Oct 03, 2008, 01:32 AM // 01:32

What about a discount in merchants or something more useful than an aura?

Joe Fierce · Oct 03, 2008, 02:05 AM // 02:05

wow, i'm loving how this has become a pve vs pvp thread, it's pretty win guys, pretty win.

seriously though, i would never agree to an obnoxious full body chaos glove suit, because chaos gloves are retarded enough as it is, though i would support something available to the people who have gwamm that isn't e-peen inflating, something simple and not always seen, like another version of the rainbow phoenix or something to that effect, very simple, only seen when you're in their party and in zone, and has no real benefit towards the game or stroking your e-peen.

A11Eur0 · Oct 03, 2008, 06:26 AM // 06:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

Oh yes. It seems I misread.

If you're failing with "Save Yourselves!", please just uninstall.

PvE is even easy without the assistance of PvE skills anyway.

There are block stances and enchantments in PvE too. They're not just in PvP. There's kiting in PvE too, not just PvE. There ARE spikes in PvE...ever chase down a kiting healer in a group of rangers as a melee character? Oh shit there they go plinking my squishies while i'm fighting to maintain adrenaline on a running priest to keep SY! up. Aegis runs out PDQ especially since it's only at 8 prot, being on a necro and all. then what? pow pow pow pow pow pow from 5 or 6 different rangers in a single group(I'm talking venta cemetery here). Yes, most of PvE is easy, but there are quite a few areas that require massive amounts of concentration, massive amounts of experience, massive amounts of patience, or massive amounts of time to complete due to oversized mobs, overlapping patrols of mobs with super-unbalanced heal-to-damage ratios(grawl?), massive rezzing capabilities(desolation undead with 4 cavaliers and 2 acolytes...sure you can take FS...but on what? one of your discord necros? because none of the henchmen have it), massive spike AoE that wastes hero AI that just loves to clump up and stand in a sandstorm. I can keep going with specific examples but you'll come back with your holier-than-thou e-peen argument saying I fail and it'll get nowhere. So how about you take your internet cool-guy insults and shove them up your ass...i'm not uninstalling my game because I don't live up to your skewed ego-driven view of what should and should not be. I'll bet you needed help on about 50% of whatever vanquishing and HM missions you've done because your precious discordway didn't just allow you to take your c-spacing ass through most of it alone.

Your response to everything is "use discordway, use sabway, blah blah blah". Well, what if I want to have fun playing, rather than using the same 3 heroes and the same shit build everywhere? What if I want to run earthshaker, and take an interrupter, a warder, and a paragon? I'll get spanked all over tyria because it's not gimmicky, and hard mode AI is just brutal to people who just want to play for fun.

There's really no point to arguing this...I'm just saying that people put the time and effort into GWAMM title track because that's what is out there for people who don't want to/like to play gimmick builds against other gimmick builds in PvP, or don't have the /rank to do it so never get into a group to gain said rank. They should be rewarded with a little more than just a title, because not everyone can see the title right off the bat.

There's nothing wrong with something extra, like my suggestion of the ability to take the form of one of the gods in a town. I mean, it makes sense, and it's not overdone. It's on-par with tonics as well...just different. So why not?

Daft Shifty · Oct 03, 2008, 07:50 AM // 07:50

If pve is too easy try something new... maybe PVP, or do it all HM or w/e thats what I did. I got extremely bored of the pve grind and got into pvp and now that i can do both i get max bebegit from the game. and honestly GWAMM does not need any extra benefits... its leet enough as is. (though they could make it harder to get.. pvp titles take forever to max. GWAMM is almost common now.)

Tyla · Oct 03, 2008, 03:24 PM // 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

There are block stances and enchantments in PvE too. They're not just in PvP. There's kiting in PvE too, not just PvE. There ARE spikes in PvE...ever chase down a kiting healer in a group of rangers as a melee character?

If you have enough common sense to either swap targets, or in the case of heavy blocking bring Rigor Mortis or any of that other crap which heavily negates blocking, maybe it wouldn't be so "hard". And no, enemies in PvE don't kite well, and even if they do they'll probably do it predictively and you could easily fit a Deep Freeze in a team build. As for spikes in PvE, they're incredibly easy to stop if you have half a brain cell.

Quote:

Oh shit there they go plinking my squishies while i'm fighting to maintain adrenaline on a running priest to keep SY! up. Aegis runs out PDQ especially since it's only at 8 prot, being on a necro and all. then what? pow pow pow pow pow pow from 5 or 6 different rangers in a single group(I'm talking venta cemetery here).

Shield of Absorption. If you really need to get your adrenaline up that fast, isn't it sane to use Enraging Charge, "For Great Justice!" etc? And even then, if someone can't hold up a party with about 4 seconds without SY then they or you must have incredibly slow reactions or are absolutely terribad at the game.

Quote:

Yes, most of PvE is easy, but there are quite a few areas that require massive amounts of concentration, massive amounts of experience, massive amounts of patience, or massive amounts of time to complete due to oversized mobs, overlapping patrols of mobs with super-unbalanced heal-to-damage ratios(grawl?), massive rezzing capabilities(desolation undead with 4 cavaliers and 2 acolytes...sure you can take FS...but on what? one of your discord necros? because none of the henchmen have it), massive spike AoE that wastes hero AI that just loves to clump up and stand in a sandstorm. I can keep going with specific examples but you'll come back with your holier-than-thou e-peen argument saying I fail and it'll get nowhere. So how about you take your internet cool-guy insults and shove them up your ass...i'm not uninstalling my game because I don't live up to your skewed ego-driven view of what should and should not be. I'll bet you needed help on about 50% of whatever vanquishing and HM missions you've done because your precious discordway didn't just allow you to take your c-spacing ass through most of it alone.

Hmm...

Let's see now, predictive mob hits a single target. Monk that isn't dumb uses Shield of Absorption and/or Protective Spirit and clears up the bits that get through. Predictive mob is screwed up.

For res skills? Just bash them 'tiln they die, or shut down / spike key enemies. It's really not that hard.

I didn't need help on my vanquishes and missions. I just find it more fun playing with players, and even then not taking that advantage is gimping myself when I have the oppertunity to. What, you're going to tell me that "You needed help" again because I took all advantages possible? Does this mean I should drop every single efficient part of my skill bars, drop all attributes to 0, use starter armour and no skills? No.

Quote:

Your response to everything is "use discordway, use sabway, blah blah blah". Well, what if I want to have fun playing, rather than using the same 3 heroes and the same shit build everywhere? What if I want to run earthshaker, and take an interrupter, a warder, and a paragon? I'll get spanked all over tyria because it's not gimmicky, and hard mode AI is just brutal to people who just want to play for fun.

Run it if you want, I run what is effective. Yes, Paragons, interrupters, ES and all that crap is effective too, I'm merely stating that I'd rather use that instead because I can't be bothered microing my heroes when it shouldn't be neccessary. Discord is an easy passage through PvE and there's no reason I shouldn't take what I find best to run. If I wanted to make it hard for myself I'd just as easily do what I could do in the above part of this post.

Quote:

There's really no point to arguing this...I'm just saying that people put the time and effort into GWAMM title track because that's what is out there for people who don't want to/like to play gimmick builds against other gimmick builds in PvP, or don't have the /rank to do it so never get into a group to gain said rank. They should be rewarded with a little more than just a title, because not everyone can see the title right off the bat.

PuGs are even bad in PvP anyway. Just because you can complete PvE doesn't mean you deserve more of a reward than the words below your name.

A11Eur0 · Oct 03, 2008, 07:37 PM // 19:37

You're applying mentalities people would use if they played monk, or necro, or if you just had a full team of players.

It's me as a warrior, 3 heroes and henchmen. Henchmen monks aren't going to pre-prot. Heroes/henchmen attack the target that I attack...so they're going to ignore the melee amongst them in order to also chase said kiting monk.

Have you ever used enraging charge? 15 second recharge, and ends on hit. So, I use it once, catch up to a kiting enemy(in hard mode, moving at the same speed I am now), hit them, get enough for one SY! with FGJ! up, then I try to spike him down. Doesn't work because he's still kiting and he has the ability to heal through my normal attack speed. If I switch targets to something else, that super-efficient monk can outheal my henchmens' damage. It's a stalemate. So...it's not just c-spacing. It's having to adapt every skill bar in the team to the hardest mobs in that specific area. It's the same principle of PvP in effect...running the most efficient skill bars for the fighting you expect to be doing. If someone runs a super build in PvE but doesn't know it, he'll fail and the group will suffer. Same as PvP.

Just because you can play one part in PvP very well and farm fame doesn't mean you deserve more of a reward than the words below your name. See, I can do it too. It takes time in both cases. The players that actually use real tactics and can go without using gimmick builds while dominating deserve their /rank emotes. Players in PvE who don't use gimmick hero builds and actually use their brains deserve something more. People who farm day in and day out can buy their zrank title. Players who actually play the game don't get the same cash income thus don't have the capability of having as high a zrank title. So, it's a farmer/PvP title, not a PvE player title. So, I think GWAMM which is actually a player title should have something equivalent so they can reward the rest of us who don't farm as much and who don't enjoy PvP.

Pretty much in a nutshell: fame farmers and gold farmers get rewarded for their "grind" but people who actually play the game as it was intended get the short shaft. And you support this.

Tyla · Oct 03, 2008, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

You're applying mentalities people would use if they played monk, or necro, or if you just had a full team of players.

You, being the SY bearer have control on who you attack. Shield of Absorption could be put on any hero. Yes, sometimes you need to micro to prevent deaths.

Quote:

It's me as a warrior, 3 heroes and henchmen. Henchmen monks aren't going to pre-prot. Heroes/henchmen attack the target that I attack...so they're going to ignore the melee amongst them in order to also chase said kiting monk.

Melee physicals are quite weak, and I'd always try and fit in SoA on one of my heroes. If an enemy was kiting you could always use a fat snare, such as Deep Freeze.

Quote:

Have you ever used enraging charge? 15 second recharge, and ends on hit. So, I use it once, catch up to a kiting enemy(in hard mode, moving at the same speed I am now), hit them, get enough for one SY! with FGJ! up, then I try to spike him down. Doesn't work because he's still kiting and he has the ability to heal through my normal attack speed. If I switch targets to something else, that super-efficient monk can outheal my henchmens' damage. It's a stalemate. So...it's not just c-spacing. It's having to adapt every skill bar in the team to the hardest mobs in that specific area.

Deep Freeze, again. Even then, if you are having trouble with kiting enemies you could always bring a knockdown, such as Brawling Headbutt or Bull's Strike if you want to anticipate. Deep Freeze is a pretty awesome skill when it comes to snaring needs in PvE anyway.

Quote:

It's the same principle of PvP in effect...running the most efficient skill bars for the fighting you expect to be doing. If someone runs a super build in PvE but doesn't know it, he'll fail and the group will suffer. Same as PvP.

The difference is, you don't need to micro your heroes with certain builds. Load the build up and c-space. PvP is different, because you're playing with a full group of players for the most part whereas in PvE your heroes pretty much do all the work, assuming you're in a hero/hench group. Even then all you need is players with common sense.

Quote:

Just because you can play one part in PvP very well and farm fame doesn't mean you deserve more of a reward than the words below your name. See, I can do it too. It takes time in both cases. The players that actually use real tactics and can go without using gimmick builds while dominating deserve their /rank emotes. Players in PvE who don't use gimmick hero builds and actually use their brains deserve something more.

Well I for one am not bothered if /Rank gets removed. Heck, people who run decent builds often don't even care about rank, because they don't PuG, and they don't PuG because they know it will result in failure while using the /Rank as a little pissaround.

Quote:

People who farm day in and day out can buy their zrank title. Players who actually play the game don't get the same cash income thus don't have the capability of having as high a zrank title. So, it's a farmer/PvP title, not a PvE player title. So, I think GWAMM which is actually a player title should have something equivalent so they can reward the rest of us who don't farm as much and who don't enjoy PvP.

Someone who has GWAMM, most of the time has atleast one of those stupid farms where you need over 1 million. Not to mention that if you use your money conservatively you can get it still, not to mention the Xunlai House which gives free points.

Quote:

Pretty much in a nutshell: fame farmers and gold farmers get rewarded for their "grind" but people who actually play the game as it was intended get the short shaft. And you support this.

So, the gold sink titles aren't grind? SS/LB? Rep titles? K/L?

The only titles that require gameplay are as followed:

Vanquisher (Let's just say 3 titles)
Protector (^)
Guardian (^)
Legendary Master of the North
Survivor (Outside of FFF / Kilroy)

Now, that's 11 titles, taking out Survivor if you earned it from Kilroy. That is excluding Legendary Vanquisher, and Legendary Guardian considering they are only a jump from the first three titles. Cartographer is excluded simply because scraping isn't really gameplay in essence.

The rest are either gold sinks or reputation grinds. If you have GWAMM, there is no way in hell you can't afford a cheap price of 250k.

Sheep Assassin · Oct 15, 2008, 01:20 AM // 01:20

i agree that would be a good thing to add, it would make heads turn and make poeple have something to work for

tmakinen · Oct 15, 2008, 07:08 AM // 07:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Fierce

i would support something available to the people who have gwamm that isn't e-peen inflating, something simple and not always seen, like another version of the rainbow phoenix or something to that effect, very simple, only seen when you're in their party and in zone, and has no real benefit towards the game or stroking your e-peen.

That is by far the best GWAMM related suggestion I have ever seen. Make it so that once you have GWAMM and a full HoM, instead of the usual Rainbow Phoenix a lv5 Rainbow Dragon spawns. Combine that with the upcoming account wide HoM upgrade so that your ranger can tame the pet even if s/he is not the actual r6 character and (almost*) everybody will be happy.

*) there's no pleasing some people no matter what you do ...

Owik Gall · Oct 15, 2008, 07:17 AM // 07:17

I wouldn't be inspired to get the title because let's face it, a grind title is a grind title, no matter what. I would prefer there would be effects for other titles like maybe Legendary Guardian. Hell, I would like to see different titles turn up that would DESERVE an aura. Although it is a nice touch for the God title it would do little to inspire players to get it. Patience isn't always everyone's virtue.

Day Trooper · Oct 15, 2008, 06:30 PM // 18:30

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyla

Oh yes. It seems I misread.

If you're failing with "Save Yourselves!", please just uninstall.

PvE is even easy without the assistance of PvE skills anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

There are block stances and enchantments in PvE too. They're not just in PvP. There's kiting in PvE too, not just PvE. There ARE spikes in PvE...ever chase down a kiting healer in a group of rangers as a melee character? Oh shit there they go plinking my squishies while i'm fighting to maintain adrenaline on a running priest to keep SY! up. Aegis runs out PDQ especially since it's only at 8 prot, being on a necro and all. then what? pow pow pow pow pow pow from 5 or 6 different rangers in a single group(I'm talking venta cemetery here). Yes, most of PvE is easy, but there are quite a few areas that require massive amounts of concentration, massive amounts of experience, massive amounts of patience, or massive amounts of time to complete due to oversized mobs, overlapping patrols of mobs with super-unbalanced heal-to-damage ratios(grawl?), massive rezzing capabilities(desolation undead with 4 cavaliers and 2 acolytes...sure you can take FS...but on what? one of your discord necros? because none of the henchmen have it), massive spike AoE that wastes hero AI that just loves to clump up and stand in a sandstorm. I can keep going with specific examples but you'll come back with your holier-than-thou e-peen argument saying I fail and it'll get nowhere. So how about you take your internet cool-guy insults and shove them up your ass...i'm not uninstalling my game because I don't live up to your skewed ego-driven view of what should and should not be. I'll bet you needed help on about 50% of whatever vanquishing and HM missions you've done because your precious discordway didn't just allow you to take your c-spacing ass through most of it alone.

Your response to everything is "use discordway, use sabway, blah blah blah". Well, what if I want to have fun playing, rather than using the same 3 heroes and the same shit build everywhere? What if I want to run earthshaker, and take an interrupter, a warder, and a paragon? I'll get spanked all over tyria because it's not gimmicky, and hard mode AI is just brutal to people who just want to play for fun.

There's really no point to arguing this...

I lol'd at this

Why? Because A11Eur0 is correct!

Anyone who tells you to use the same gimmicky builds (discordway, sabway, blah blah blah

) to complete every zone for Legendary Vanquisher (hero/hench anyways) is just full of complete bs. From experience, I know that some areas require completely different teams/builds than others.

Also, it makes me sick how peeps say 'PvE HM is sooo easy - just c-space your way through it n00000b!'. Maybe with real peeps and cons it becomes this way - but try h/h vanquishing Mourning Veil Falls, or Tahnnakai Temple, or Easter Frontier (4-man) *with no cons* and tell me how easy it is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

I'm just saying that people put the time and effort into GWAMM title track because that's what is out there for people who don't want to/like to play gimmick builds against other gimmick builds in PvP, or don't have the /rank to do it so never get into a group to gain said rank. They should be rewarded with a little more than just a title, because not everyone can see the title right off the bat.

There's nothing wrong with something extra, like my suggestion of the ability to take the form of one of the gods in a town. I mean, it makes sense, and it's not overdone. It's on-par with tonics as well...just different. So why not?

And I definitely agree that the GWaMM title should get a little something more than just words under your name. I mean - that's all the 'max rank of the maxed titles' title gets??

I just seems that if someone can spend 250k to get a ZRank emote - then someone who's played the game long enough to get GWaMM should also get an emote or something 'more visible', too, to reward their efforts

Bobulation · Oct 15, 2008, 07:26 PM // 19:26

PvE HM is easy, wanna know why? Because you can go to gw.gamewikis.org and check what area your going into, and PLAN AHEAD. If you aren't completely bad then you can see what skills you need to bring for offense and defense and roll through PvE. GWAMM shouldn't get anything extra, because that would be rewarding time>skill. There shouldn't be any PvE grinding titles at all.

Oh yeah, and the EotN Grind titles should at least be combined.

illidan009 · Oct 16, 2008, 12:35 AM // 00:35

I also suggest that not just for GWAMM but also each rank of KoaBD should have a special looking thing...with GWAMM looking the coolest of course. After all, not a lot of ppl would grind for 2000+ hours just to finally see some digital light...

Tyla · Oct 16, 2008, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Day Trooper

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyla

Oh yes. It seems I misread.

If you're failing with "Save Yourselves!", please just uninstall.

PvE is even easy without the assistance of PvE skills anyway.

I lol'd at this

Why? Because A11Eur0 is correct!

Anyone who tells you to use the same gimmicky builds (discordway, sabway, blah blah blah

) to complete every zone for Legendary Vanquisher (hero/hench anyways) is just full of complete bs. From experience, I know that some areas require completely different teams/builds than others.

Also, it makes me sick how peeps say 'PvE HM is sooo easy - just c-space your way through it n00000b!'. Maybe with real peeps and cons it becomes this way - but try h/h vanquishing Mourning Veil Falls, or Tahnnakai Temple, or Easter Frontier (4-man) *with no cons* and tell me how easy it is.

I've already completed both of those places with those same old gimmicks which allow C-Spacability under H/H. Heck, there's even a screenshot of someone wearing no armour, or skills on a completely vanquished area with H/H. I don't even think he was using Sabway either.

Oh, and when you have people still running Mending on their bars with GWAMM, or a Ranger not using D-Shot on his bar with a bow at rank 5 KoaBD it's also evident that it's not exactly "pro". And don't try that "Hero / Zaishen gets one" crap, I'd rather see those emotes removed and replaced onto the Champion title instead. Even the Champion title is debatable for an emote.